These are my random musings. Hopefully they will be witty, insightful, and frequently updated.
The 4th Amendment and you...
Published on December 17, 2005 By singrdave In Current Events
Read, please... this information is readily available to the public.

The Fourth Amendment to the United States Constitution:
Amendment IV
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.


The Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978.

Letter dated 12/23/2002 from the Justice Department to Sen. Russ Feingold (D-Wis) regarding the USAPATRIOT Act and how it is in accordance with the 4th Amendment:

Transcript of Senate Judiciary Committee dated 10 September 2002 regarding the impact of the USAPATRIOT Act on FISA:


Comments (Page 1)
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on Dec 17, 2005
Can I get a summary of where you are trying to get with this information? Readers Digest condensed version please?
on Dec 17, 2005

Just the facts, man.

I don't feel comfortable giving my opinion on this because this is about my employer.

Sorry no homework helps here. But feel free to use this information as ammunition against Clueless Old Losers.
on Dec 17, 2005
If Prs. Bush did commit a crime here, let the legal (and political) chips fall where they may.

However, the New York times sat on this story almost a year. You'd think that if this was such a terrible and unconstitutional act, they wouldn't have waited to run with it.

It's also interesting to me that members of the House and Senate also knew... so where were the demands for investigations then?

So, if a crime was commited and members of Congress didn't say anything... how many of them are willing to see an investigation into the "conspiracy"?
on Dec 18, 2005

It is really simple.  It is legal, they dont like it. 

I understand english and spin.  Shame most do not.

on Dec 18, 2005
WHY did Bush not obey this Law? Under what law did Bush have the authority to bypass this process and the courts to wire tap Americans? Sec Rice said Bush was operating within the law but failed to identify the law.

This matter needs to be addressed. The country needs to know if the actions of Mr. Bush were within the laws of this country. If he was operating legally then the matter should be put to rest. If he has violated the laws he needs to be removed from office. This is not a minor issue and if there is a legal question, it MUST be addressed by the Supreme Court of the United States.
on Dec 18, 2005
One question - Since the President classified this information, were the members of Congress that were made aware of the President's actions able to come forward?
on Dec 18, 2005
Yes Colon Gangrene, as you well know, a criminal act under the protection of security classification is still a criminal act. The means of investigating, while still maintaining the security has been in place a long time.

This didn't bother them until it was made public. Which means it didn't matter to them until they could use it to their political advantage.
on Dec 18, 2005
This matter needs to be addressed. The country needs to know if the actions of Mr. Bush were within the laws of this country. If he was operating legally then the matter should be put to rest. If he has violated the laws he needs to be removed from office. This is not a minor issue and if there is a legal question, it MUST be addressed by the Supreme Court of the United States.


Apparently it was a minor issue, until liars like Reid could use it for political advantage.

There is more political stink on this than even the New York Times could shovel out.
on Dec 18, 2005
This was NEVER a minor issue. If the President has violated the Constitution and laws he has sworn to uphold this is not a political toy. Some may use it as such but the issue is did Bush violate the laws of the United States?

If members of Congress failed to come forward about the President violating the laws, they need to be delt with as the law provides - Republicabns and Democrats alike. This holds the potential of becomming another Nixon.
on Dec 18, 2005
Agreed, if Prs. Bush did break the law, he needs to answer for it. However, so does everyone who sat on it for a year.

When is Prs. Clinton going to answer for using the FBI and IRS as his own little strong arm organizations? Again.. .YOU DON"T CARE, do you Colon Gangrene!
on Dec 18, 2005

One question - Since the President classified this information, were the members of Congress that were made aware of the President's actions able to come forward?
The dates I cited are indicative of who knew and when they knew.
The media got this information somewhere.
Feingold, Leahy, and all the Senate Judiciary Committee received briefings on this in 2002.
on Dec 18, 2005
Exactly Singr... isn't it interesting that they waited until now to whine about "investigations" and "probes". Could it be that they are only playing to the press for political gain? Could it be that they are conspirators to whatever "crime" may have been committed here?
on Dec 18, 2005
The most important issue is what game the President is playing. Why did he not use the courts as the law requires?
on Dec 21, 2005
Why did he not use the courts as the law requires?


It's important here to note the difference between the regular court system and the FISA court. The FISA court acts in secret due to security and operational concerns. The court system is a matter of public record and can be scrutinized and publicized to the media heart's content. (Oh, sorry, did I imply that the media has a collective heart?)
on Dec 21, 2005
The most important issue is what game the President is playing. Why did he not use the courts as the law requires?



But it does not bother you in the least, that members of congress knew about this....and DID NOTHING (if indeed it is/was criminal)????

You mean to tell me, if someone kidnapped you, and beat the living crap out of you every day, and I knew about it....but did nothing because the guys that kidnapped you asked me not to. And then one day, the cops finally find you and get you out of there, and they ask me about it, and I say, I knew it was going on all along, but he asked me not to say anything...you wouldn't be upset with me???? I would be just as guilty as the kidnappers....

But yet, you say that the most important thing is what Bush is doing. Congress knew about, and didn't do a thing....well, until they needed to save their own asses regarding it. Oh, it is easy to say, "I thought he just kept falling down the stairs every night. That is what I thought all that screaming and beating was that was going on next door. I didn't know that they were actually beating Gene." It is easy to say that when I finally get caught.

Bush so far, again, is the only one standing by what he has done. Everyone else turns tail and runs for the hills (congress), while the "Cowboy" stands in the street, ready for the noon-time to arrive.

Gene, think about it. Congress knew about this, and if it was indeed illegal, and they didn't do anything (until they could be in trouble), and you think that is "ok"???

Maybe you should run for congress, I am sure you would fit right in there with those half-cracks in Washington

Let me also say, if Bush did indeed break the law, let him pay the piper. But, also, in the same breath, those that knew about it (and not just sent a memo), let them answer to the law also.
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