These are my random musings. Hopefully they will be witty, insightful, and frequently updated.
Feigning Outrage on Behalf of Gitmo Detainees
Published on January 8, 2007 By singrdave In War on Terror
From the Chicago Tribune, January 5, 2007:

Consider The Irony Of Guantanamo Bay

By Thomas P. Sullivan


What an irony, what a contradiction! Although the trial may have been flawed and the execution precipitous, the Iraqi government afforded a mass murderer, Saddam Hussein, basic rights before judgment was pronounced. Hussein was presented with written
charges, provided the assistance of lawyers, the government was required to introduce proof to support its charges through competent witnesses, whom his lawyers were permitted to cross-examine, and he was allowed to produce evidence in his own defense.

Compare this to the way our government has handled the cases of more than 400 men, most of whom have been held almost five years in a prison at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. Not a single one has been given a hearing at which the government has been required to
produce evidence explaining why he is being held, or had the assistance of a lawyer, or an opportunity to produce evidence in his own defense. No so-called classified evidence has been revealed. No independent judges have presided.

It now appears clear that virtually none of these men will ever receive these kinds of trials. United States officials have announced that only a handful of the prisoners will be tried before the newly created military commissions, while the others will continue to languish indefinitely in their tiny cages.

Army and Navy brass have become accessories to this scandalous state of affairs by continuing to claim that the prisoners are dangerous, the "worst of the worst," as though this provides justification for continuing to jail them without hearings. Even more
shameful, a congressional majority mindlessly succumbed to White House pressure by voting to deprive the prisoners of the right to seek relief in federal courts.

It has been argued that "military necessity" precludes providing legal protections to the prisoners and that to do so will interfere with conduct of the "war on terror." But these men are not held on or near a battlefield. They are isolated on a remote island; almost
none has been questioned within the past two years; they no longer have unplumbed "intelligence" value.

The cost to maintain this prison, and the need to provide round-the-clock supervision, is clearly inconsistent with our national interests. Far better to charge and try those where there is solid evidence they committed punishable offenses and release the others without further delay, expense and diversion of military and civilian personnel. Those found guilty should be sentenced appropriately, and those not charged or found not guilty after trial should be returned to their native countries. The least we should do for them is what was done for Saddam Hussein.

Refusal to afford due process of law to these men is a national disgrace. If compliance with fundamental principles is insufficient to motivate our leaders--if they require selfish reasons to move them to action--they should bear in mind the precedent they are setting
for how other nations may treat our citizens taken into custody abroad.

Thomas P. Sullivan, who represents a number of prisoners at Guantanamo Bay, is a partner in the law firm Jenner and Block and was co-chair of the Governor's Commission on Capital Punishment. He was the U.S. attorney for the Northern District of Illinois from 1977 to 1981.

My response to Mr. Sullivan:

Consider this: Your average hajji imprisoned in Gitmo is not Saddam Hussein.

Lots of people go get Starbucks every day, but when Jennifer Aniston does it makes front page headlines. Fame has its privileges.

Saddam gets held to a higher standard of justice than your average hajji. And you're outraged, or even surprised by this, Mr. Sullivan? This is the way the world works.

Comments (Page 2)
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on Jan 10, 2007
While prisoners of war can be held until the end of hostilities, the Genenva Conventions are silent on unlawful combatants, simply because they are not contemplated for. This the crux of the issue.


Not really. The clause that covers the treatment of spies is how they address illegal combatants. If a person is not in a recognized uniform and carying weapons they are an illegal combatant. They are not covered by the Geneva Concventions. According to internationl law those people have no legal standing. It is then left up to the Government that captured the person to do with them what they want. The purpose of doing this was to keep people from fighting a war of terror where one side has rules that must be followed and the other side free to do what they want without fear if they are captured. If you don't wear the uniform you can be shot without a trial. Like the death penalty for murder, it serves as a deterant to ensue nations play by the rules and to punish those that break the rules. There are no international rules of war that covers terrorism.

The problem is that idiots feel that giving rights to people that want to destroy the systme that would protect them. We as a nation instead of killing anyone carrying a weapon on the battle field they are locked up and fed and treated better they they treat is when captured.
on Jan 11, 2007
If you don't wear the uniform you can be shot without a trial.


This is incorrect. The Supreme Court has held that at least the barest minimum safeguards under the Geneva Conventions applies to detainees at Guantanamo Bay, including a prohibition on summary executions. This applies equally to spies, saboteurs and now terrorists.

The relevant DoD memo confirming this can be found here: WWW Link
on Jan 11, 2007
This is incorrect. The Supreme Court has held that at least the barest minimum safeguards under the Geneva Conventions applies to detainees at Guantanamo Bay, including a prohibition on summary executions. This applies equally to spies, saboteurs and now terrorists.


And "you" are incorrect! On the field of battle, if you're not wearing a uniform and you're carrying weapons, you can and most probably "will" be shot! The linked article that you posted carries nothing in it but treatment for "detainees". Nothing to do with field of battle.
on Jan 11, 2007
Sorry the discussion was about the detainees at Guantanamo Bay, I just assumed that's what he was talking about.
on Jan 11, 2007
Gingrich proposed that there be another Geneva convention called to make rules for unlawful combatants. Of course he was jeered by the left for suggesting this because he is Newt Gingrich and therefore must not be allowed to be right on even the most obvious things.
on Jan 11, 2007
Gingrich proposed that there be another Geneva convention called to make rules for unlawful combatants. Of course he was jeered by the left for suggesting this because he is Newt Gingrich and therefore must not be allowed to be right on even the most obvious things.


I was reading an ICRC lawyer's (i think) opinion on the rights of unlawful comabatants, it includes selected comments by various delegates at the drafting of the Geneva Convention back in 1949 as to whether or not more should be included on the topic. I'll try to dig this up when I have time, perhaps tomorrow, as I found some of them quite interesting, if anyone cares?
on Jan 13, 2007
This is incorrect. The Supreme Court has held that at least the barest minimum safeguards under the Geneva Conventions applies to detainees at Guantanamo Bay, including a prohibition on summary executions. This applies equally to spies, saboteurs and now terrorists.


Yes, that is what the Courts say, not the Conventions. The courts have chosen to add to the international law which is legal. Prior to this ruling we were legally allowed to shoot them on sight, or torture them because they are not covered by the Geneva Conventions. Something we never did, instead we captured them and housed them treating them as if they were legal combatants. My point is that legally we were not required to do any of this until the court made a ruling.
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