When Air Marshals Attack!

Zero Tolerance sure applies here

Published on December 7, 2005 By singrdave In Current Events

I was tempted to put 'Zero Tolerance' in the title rather than the subtitle so I could get more looks, but I held back.

U.S. air marshals on Wednesday shot and killed an American Airlines passenger who claimed to be carrying a bomb in his backpack at Miami International Airport. He was disembarking from a flight that had just arrived at Miami from Medellin, Colombia.

Let me get this straight: a man who had just landed in America starts breaking for the door, pushing through the crowd in the aisle. They are trying to get their carry-on bags from their overhead compartments, and he's shouting he has a bomb and making for the door. Not a good situation.

Complicating things, the flight just came from Medellin, Colombia. Pablo Escobar's homies are from there; not the most secure place in the western hemisphere, that's for sure. Medellin Cartel link No assurance that the baggage or the passengers had been properly inspected before departure. No assurance of much of anything, since the plane was coming from abroad, to be honest. There are several airports in the world where lax to no security checks take place, especially to the American standard. If we can't find everyone (see 9/11), then how can we expect every little podunk third-world backwater airport to inspect shoes?

So the guy decides that he doesn't want to play nice with the air marshals. From Reuters:
"Many details of the shooting remain confused, but officials in Washington said the man tried to flee, ignored an order to put his bag on the ground and was shot on the passenger gangway.
"The passenger then reached into his carry-on bag, at which point, consistent with air marshal training, the air marshals took the appropriate actions. Shots were fired as the team attempted to subdue the subject," said a Department of Homeland Security spokesman."

No kidding they shot him! He was clearly disobeying their instructions and reaching into his bag. For all the air marshals knew, he had a detonator in there. They acted in order to save the 300 people on the flight, as well as many other hundreds in the terminal.

All I can say is NICE JOB, AIR MARSHALS!

Comments (Page 2)

bakerstreet

on Dec 08, 2005

I'm trying to follow the logic here...

-a guy is acting deranged, claiming to have a bomb.
-someone tells you that he is bi-polar, and off his medication.
-Oh! you say, no wonder. Of course a deranged person wouldn't have a bomb...

Maybe I am old-fashioned, but I consider most people with bombs to be deranged. Telling me that he is bi-polar and unmedicated doesn't make me less apt to shoot him, it makes me MORE apt to shoot him. The point isn't giving the guy the benefit of the doubt, it is the safety of the passengers on the plane.

kingbee

on Dec 08, 2005

you'd almost have to be crazy to sneak a bomb onto a plane coming to the us from colombia (to try sneaking anything on such a plane for that matter) only to reveal you had it after landing and then run off the plane with it.

actually you'd have to be stupid as well.

btw...imagine you're a passenger on that flight with like 65 'pellets'--each containing about 4 gms of uncut cocaine--percolating in your digestive tract. the plane lands, you're bracin yourself to not attract any attention as you go thru customs and lookin forward outta the airport and get all that dope safely outta you...and then things suddenly go totally chaotic and you KNOW time is about to start really laggin bad.

latour999

on Dec 09, 2005

I'm not going to start defending this guy like I did for Jean Charles de Menezes. There is a major difference between this guy and de Menezes. de Menezes never claimed to have a bomb, he was just acting normally. From what I heard, this guy claimed to have a bomb. They did what had to be done (unless some more stuff comes out later like it did in the de Menezes case).

singrdave

on Dec 09, 2005

Don't get me wrong, I feel badly for the guy and his family. I am sad that he died.
But you've gotta admit, he brought it on himself. You just can't do what he did where he did it and expect to live.

To be honest when I first saw the news broadcast, I thought it might have been a suicidal guy who wanted to go out in a blaze.

Rabbit

on Dec 09, 2005

Yea just shoot, and shoot him again to make sure hes dead. "Shoot to kill", that's prob. how those Marshals get trained.
How about immobilizing.... especially when a woman is screaming "don't shoot, hes ill". To much stress for the Marshal?

singrdave

on Dec 10, 2005

Reply By: Rabbit(Anonymous User)

Too bad you weren't on the plane, buddy. Trolling fool.

Dr Guy

on Dec 10, 2005

Real life is not a hollywood movie. They miss, he blows up 50 or more people, and you would be crowing about how incompetant they are.

next time you are being robbed, call a crook. The police are not up to your perfect standards. Idiot.

bakerstreet

on Dec 10, 2005

"Yea just shoot, and shoot him again to make sure hes dead. "Shoot to kill", that's prob. how those Marshals get trained.
How about immobilizing.... especially when a woman is screaming "don't shoot, hes ill". To much stress for the Marshal?"

note to self... next time I want to do something illegal, take a woman with me to scream "HE FORGOT TO TAKE HIS MEDS"...

garsgolfer

on Dec 12, 2005

It's about time the government realized it's duty by including undercover combat trained marshals on various flights with a license to shoot if needed. However, the downside is due to the immediate demand of such skills, they don't receive nearly enough close quarter firing of their .45's in pressure sensitive cabins. We can only hope that all confrontations are before cabin pressurization or after depressurization. Hostage negotiation skills would be an added benefit but all to often the scenario will escalate at such an extreme pace, such skills will likely fall on someone's dead ears within seconds.

As I understand it, the man shot was off his med's, making his behavior iritic and uncontrollable from a distance. Under such circumstances, we can't in our remotest dreams expect a Marshall to exercise precognitive behavior assessment skills and react as needed in those seconds. It's sad that he died under such circumstances. But, it's a good way for a schizophrenic having a lucid moment to commit suicide knowing that under similar circumstances in other public places, shooting isn't likely any longer.

Island Dog

on Dec 12, 2005

We can only hope that all confrontations are before cabin pressurization or after depressurization. Hostage negotiation skills would be an added benefit but all to often the scenario will escalate at such an extreme pace, such skills will likely fall on someone's dead ears within seconds.

Air marshalls carry special weapons designed not to penetrate the hull of the aircraft.

Tova7

on Dec 12, 2005

Air marshalls carry special weapons designed not to penetrate the hull of the aircraft.

Well that is a very good thing because my b/f from highschool has an older brother who is an Air Marshall and he can't hit the side of a barn standing next to it! He had to take the shooting test like ten times and finally passed...but is still a lousy shot. He admits if he ever has to shoot anyone, the person he is aiming at has about a 75% chance of not getting hit (and that's if he is standing next to him!LOL)

garsgolfer

on Dec 13, 2005

Air marshals carry special weapons designed not to penetrate the hull of the aircraft.

I use to load my own .45 & 9mm ammo depending on need, along with others during my younger years of offshore travel. I was trained in a variety of small weapons, close quarter hand to hand combat and still keep my skills sharp with my .45. I heard from an ole friend in an agency those marshals carry small frame.45's with lite loads for stopping power. 9mm require double even triple taps to insure stopping a pumped threat. Even with lite loads the stopping power of one round is considerably better then a two 9's, less likely to penetrate the hull and reduces the possibility of collateral damage. I've known in some cases agents train in close quarters with hard rubber bullets. Just can't believe air marshals would go that way since lethal threats have been known to wear body armor and carry real bullets.

singrdave

on Dec 15, 2005

Air marshalls carry special weapons designed not to penetrate the hull of the aircraft.

Well that is a very good thing because my b/f from highschool has an older brother who is an Air Marshall and he can't hit the side of a barn standing next to it! He had to take the shooting test like ten times and finally passed...but is still a lousy shot. He admits if he ever has to shoot anyone, the person he is aiming at has about a 75% chance of not getting hit (and that's if he is standing next to him!

Luckily he'll be on the inside of the barn. While the barn is moving at 650 miles per hour at 40,000 feet... not so lucky.
I have no problem with the air marshal program. I'm actually quite happy that this happened, since now I know those air marshals will do their job.
I just hope and pray the powers-that-be don't gut the air marshal program over this.

since lethal threats have been known to wear body armor and carry real bullets.

Exactly how do you see them getting THAT STUFF on the plane? Holy crap, if they can get past security with that arsenal, they deserve to win.

Gideon MacLeish

on Dec 17, 2005

He was just a passenger, until he started screaming and made a bolt for the door. As for 'terror suspect', I think the MSM coverage is bearing out that he was suspected of carrying a bomb by his own admission.

When he was SHOT, he was a "terror suspect". So, a "passenger" wasn't shot, but a "terror suspect" was shot. Big difference in how that's read!

Gideon MacLeish

on Dec 17, 2005

How about immobilizing.... especially when a woman is screaming "don't shoot, hes ill". To much stress for the Marshal?

Cops are trained when they clear leather to shoot at the center of mass. That means they have a greater margin for error and less chance for collateral damage. A shot to the center of mass will also be the most likely to immobilize the subject, as it is most likely a deadly shot.

The fact that there has been only ONE such incident since 9/11 should show you that these are NOT gun happy air marshalls. We cannot second guess our officers when they act as they are trained to act and it doesn't have a Disney ending.

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